Prominent MLB Insider Not a Fan of Seattle Mariners New Piggyback Plan
The Mariners have brought back their piggyback plan, albeit with a new twist. Buster Olney of ESPN gave his opinion on it on the most recent 'Refuse to Lose Territory' podcast.
Video Transcript
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It's that time to put on your jersey and wave your flag, whoever you root for.
Why do I watch the World Cup?
Pfft, that's like asking me, "Why do I breathe?"
And it's beautiful.
The guys are young and cute and fit.
It's not just a game.
It's your culture.
I like watching it with my dad.
It's a connecting force.
From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Chavarry, and this is American Ftbol, a show about soccer culture in the US and its underdog roots.
Listen to American Ftbol on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Joy is essential, and it's also elusive.
But now, there's a new and exciting way to start your journey toward a more joyful existence, Joy 101.
It's a new podcast hosted by me, Hoda Kotb.
If you're craving inspiration to maximize your joy, tune into these candid, uplifting, and moving on-air chats.
Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Joy 101, and listen now.
Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb is presented by CVS.
All right.
Welcome back in.
Refuse to Lose territory here on this Thursday.
Mariners right now, 38 and 37.
One game over .500.
Finishing up a series with the Baltimore Orioles just hours from now, looking to win the series.
Joining me now, ESPN MLB Insider Buster Olney, as he does every Thursday.
Buster, how are you?
I'm doing great, Brady.
How you doing?
I am doing well.
I gotta tell you, I, I was coming back on the train from Washington, DC the other day, Mariners/Nationals, and on the train sitting next to me was a guy I randomly used to work with in Vermont who knows you and your family.
So, the Buster Olney, you know, friend tree is everywhere, even on a train ride from DC to New York.
Yeah.
I texted my sister, who knows your friend better than I do, a- and, she just said, "Man, small world."
Like, I mean, who would've, who would've guessed that?
You're, you're coming back from, from that weekend on that trip in the middle of, you know, in the middle of the Atlantic, and you're bumping into somebody who's got Vermont roots.
So very, very cool.
Let's, let's go back a little bit before we go forward.
I saw the Mariners in DC.
You saw the Mariners on the ESPN broadcast last Thursday in Baltimore.
Again, the Mariners lost, but what was your ultimal, ul- ultimate impression of being around the M's, here in June?
that they were definitely in a good place, right?
You, you could feel the optimism around the team.
I think, with Colt Emerson, you know, emerging as such an important f- part of the team.
That w- that was a lot of my conversations, you know, were about, with guys like Manny Acta and Perry Hill and guys on the team.
I think there was a lot of excitement about Cal Raleigh coming back and the thought that, in a sense, he was gonna restart, and a, a lot of good feelings about the pitching at that time.
But man, it's just incredible, you know, 'cause th- they I see them in Baltimore, and then of course, things happen and they got injuries, and all of a sudden, all kinds of concerns.
Well, here we are now at 38 and 37, still in first place, but it is a tenuous grip.
And since you saw them, Randy Arozarena's hit the injured list.
Josh Naylor and Luke Raley have been unavailable for the last few days.
Matt Brash is gonna be out a while.
We've seen Julio Rodriguez leave the game on Wednesday.
We're taping before Thursday's lineup comes out, but I shudder to think what it's actually going to look like, Buster.
What, what, what is your take on kind of what has gone on in the last week?
Yeah.
you know, it, it's interesting.
A couple years ago, the Royals made the playoffs.
They kinda came outta nowhere.
And i- you know, we were talking about different parts of their team, and I had some GMs say to me, "You know what it was?
There's a high degree of luck."
Mm-hmm.
that Royals rotation was able to stay healthy.
a- and that was just an advantage, and we're seeing it play out this year.
So many teams just decimated by injuries.
You know, the Detroit Tigers came into the year, I thought, as much of a, a, a prohibitive favorite to win their division as any team in baseball.
and then, I mean, right from the get-go, it's like this guy goes down, and this guy goes down, and this guy goes down.
and now they're sitting in a position where it looks like they're gonna be sellers before the trade deadline.
And so the Mariners, yeah, Cal Raleigh went down and, you know, you had some other bits and pieces, but they hadn't been hit by the injury bug.
It got 'em.
Man, in the last week, it hit 'em hard.
You know, I'm not really in the business of, of ranking heartaches, but when we think about how, you know, or which teams have been most affected by injuries, I'm not as up on it as you are.
The Blue Jays come to mind as maybe the team most affected, but w- where do you kinda put the Mariners in terms of who's been bitten the hardest?
Well, they're definitely not in the top five.
Like, I mean, you're 100% right.
The Toronto Blue Jays, with all the guys.
Alejandro Kirk, who, you know, such an important part of what that team is.
You know, he goes down with a thumb injury.
Just came back recently.
So many of their starting pitchers went down.
Addison Barger, who was a player they thought was gonna take a big step forward this year, he went down.
The Houston Astros.
Yeah.
Like, you know, Josh Hader starts the year on the injured list.
Hunter Brown goes down.
Jeremy Pena was out for a time.
Jose Altuve was out for a time.
Like, they were crushed.
I, I think Detroit probably the most of any team in baseball.
The Mets have been hit.
So within that context, I, I mean, I don't think you should tell the Mariners they should consider themselves fortunate, but within that context of teams most, you know, hit by injuries, they've had better luck than other teams.
You know, on one hand I feel like to sit here at 38 and 37 and be in first place is fortunate and a test of their resilience that they've been able to overcome some of this.
And other parts of me, Buster, go back to when you lose two of three to the Angels early, and you blow a game against the Padres here, and you blow a game against the Tigers there, and I'm sitting here thinking, "This is why those games matter," because you kinda wanted to have some in the bank for when something like this happened.
Yeah, I was talking with a member of the Atlanta Braves organization, in the middle of May, and the Braves, of course, one of the teams off to a great start.
and I said, "Man, you guys are rolling."
And that was the exact phrase, the one you just used, that he said, which is, "We just have to bank as many wins as possible."
Because there is that sense of what, bad luck is gonna hit us.
You know, what sorta doom is going to face us at some point in the future?
a- and, and, and he was really glad that the Braves had been able to build up that lead.
And sure enough, what's happened in the last week for the Atlanta Braves, they've had some guys go down.
Spencer Strider goes down.
Ronald Acua Jr. is out.
Michael Harris has had a lower back issue.
They're p- they're kinda scrambling right now.
So the Braves are an example of a team that banked wins.
The Mariners are an example of a team that did not.
I love the sounds, the buzzing from the stadium, the chanting from the fans, the announcers calling the plays.
Soccer, ftbol, it's home.
Why do I watch the World Cup?
Pff, that's like asking me why do I breathe.
I inherited that fandom from my mom.
I like watching it with my dad.
It's a connecting force.
From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Echavarri, and this is American Ftbol, a show about soccer culture in the US and its underdog roots.
We go beyond the game to the people and the stories that make it great.
A soccer game is a festival.
It's not just a game.
It's your culture.
I took an elbow to my head, which cracked my skull.
It is an American game.
The Brazilians don't like hearing that, though.
Are they the only ones that don't like that?
Actually, nobody likes that.
As we get ready for the Men's World Cup this summer, listen to American Ftbol as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey, I'm Hoda Kotb, host of the podcast Joy 101 With Hoda Kotb.
Together, we're gonna have meaningful conversations with the world's most fascinating people, like when actress Olivia Munn shared how she overcame fierce health challenges.
I've gone through breast cancer, and then helped my mother through breast cancer, and that was more difficult.
There's a lot of people- who understand postpartum depression.
I was not prepared for postpartum anxiety.
Listen to Joy 101 With Hoda Kotb on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
What's up, fam?
It's Isaiah Thomas.
And I'm C.J.
Toledano, and our podcast, Point Game, is about defying the odds.
Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luka and Austin Reaves.
And finding ways to win no matter what.
He's the smartest player to ever play the game.
His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before, and he knows, without Luka and Austin Reaves, "I gotta manipulate the game."
We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs.
I think Joker's gonna be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Naz Reid.
He has to guard Julius Randle, and then he has to give us everything he gives us on a night-to-night basis on offense.
And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too.
Steve Nash would get that thing.
That man hair get to flying.
He running up the court licking his fingers while he got the ball like- After you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick.
Oh, yeah.
Get your ass up and down the court and you gonna get the ball.
So listen to Point Game on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Let's talk big picture before we get smaller again.
you've been reporting on the San Francisco Giants and their trade market when it comes to guys they're willing to sell off.
ESPN put out its list the other day of the top 100 players most likely to be traded.
There are a handful of Mariners fits on that list.
What have you kinda heard or what are you thinking about the Mariners as we start to think about the deadline s- six weeks out or so?
Yeah, without a doubt, it feels like that after last weekend, like somebody hit a start gun.
Fired off a start gun, and the general managers start calling each other.
And sorta the, that early, the, the early talk of, "Well, you know, we're still trying to figure things out," that's kinda beginning to pass.
Like, the Giants are like, "We're open for business.
You know, if you wanna talk about anybody but Logan Webb and our young controllable players like Bryce Eldridge, we'll talk about Devers.
We'll talk about Willy Adames.
We'll talk about Matt Chapman."
Other teams are doing the same thing.
and then you have teams like the Tigers, which have, I mean, they're, they're, they're staring the reality in the face that they probably are gonna wind up trading Skubal.
Wow.
They're hoping to get back into it, but they have not really made up ground here in the last couple weeks.
They've had more injuries that have popped up.
so I, I, I think there are gonna be buy opportunities.
There are buy opportunities right away.
I really think when you look at the market, the guy who is the absolute perfect fit, and I'm not the first one to mention this, is Aroldis Chapman, the closer for the Boston Red Sox.
you know, you and I have talked so many times about Andrs Muos and, you know, is he, is he the guy that you fully trust?
And, and look, you give him the ball and he's gonna s- get saves most of the time.
But Aroldis Chapman is one of the three or four best closers in baseball.
I don't know what they would do with him.
If they got him, would they prefer to keep their own guy, Munoz, since he's, you know, the player that they're invested in?
But I think it would be great for them to have a safety net, especially with Brash out and with some uncertainty about what's gonna happen with Brash going forward.
And if we get into the postseason and you had an Aroldis Chapman, and let's say he's a setup man, my God.
Like, the options that Dan Wilson would have, between Speier and Ferrer and, Cade Anderson eventually will become part of that bullpen.
That would, they would have a chance to have an absolutely dominant pitching staff.
But this is early in speculation.
The one thing I would say, Craig Breslow, who's the head of baseball operations for the Boston Red Sox, has a reputation of being difficult to trade with.
Because he has a hard time, the perception of other GMs, he has a hard time making decisions.
I don't know if that fits Jerry Dipoto's style.
And so much of, the action that we see this time of year is which general managers match up well in making a deal in their personality and their deal-making style.
And I don't know if, if Craig and, and Jerry will necessarily be that.
The Mariners and Red Sox are gonna play each other this weekend.
And, and the Mariners have a chance to win a series today against the Orioles.
The Red Sox are looking to avoid a sweep against the Blue Jays.
I gotta tell you, Buster, I know what the Red Sox record says.
I'm terrified of this series, because I believe the Red Sox are gonna throw three lefties out against the Mariners in this series.
I believe it's gonna be, in some order, Suarez, Tolley, and Early.
And we know that lefties are the Mariners' kryptonite, and the Mariners are injured.
This, this upcoming series terrifies the hell out of me.
Yeah.
Well, a- and, a- I mean, that's also just where we are in baseball right now.
You know, yesterday I talked to a GM who said, "How many great teams are there in baseball?"
You know?
The Dodgers, Phillies, Braves, Brewers.
And then, you know, the Yankees could be a, a, have a chance to be a great team if they get guys back.
I think the Mariners have potential- Yeah to be a really great team by the end of the year.
But, there's so much parity, I think, right now when these series are played, so every series should terrify the Mariners and so many other teams.
Because, you know, there, it, it's not a situation where you're going in saying, "Oh, we should take two of three or three of three."
I agree with you.
with all the injuries the Mariners are dealing with, you hope you come out of this with a series win.
Let's go, for the big picture, to kind of back into the smaller picture.
Look, we've talked about the piggyback.
We've talked about the six-man rotation.
Here we are now getting the advanced piggyback.
Everybody's gonna piggyback for the Mariners until the All-Star break.
What is your thought on, Mariners pitching 3.0 here?
They're trying to keep everybody in play.
You and I have talked about this.
They're, they're trying to, essentially have it be more of a democratic process.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Rather than a I, I do think this might be a situation, though, where you need a dictator, where you need to come in.
I suspect, and I don't know this and I haven't asked anyone with the Mariners this, if Luis Castillo was in the very last year of his deal, I think it would be easier for them to go to him, "You know what?
You're going to the bullpen."
But he's not.
And, and so I think that they are trying to make this work with the guys they have, and they're trying to have some, you know, trying to please a lot of different people in this thing.
And, and I, I, I think it's a situation where you should say, "Here's the decision.
Here's why we're making it," and you move forward.
You know, let me ask you along those lines, Buster, because I said this the other day.
I think three weeks ago, Luis Castillo to the bullpen would've been a demotion.
Now, I, I think with Brash out, I look at the bullpen as, like, an opportunity for him to really help the team in a meaningful way.
I don't know if he could instantly slot in to be this team's eighth inning guy in front of Munoz, but, there, I feel like there can be a different conversation now with Luis Castillo than there would've been three weeks ago.
Because three weeks ago, it's a punishment.
Now, I don't necessarily see it that way.
So, I, I would agree with you in theory, but I think the way it's playing out means, is an indication that they're getting pushback from different people.
It's not like someone's coming forward and saying, "Hey, you know, I, I'll raise my hand.
I'll take that job.
I know, Bre- you know, that that spot is really important in our bullpen."
And given, you know, Castillo's age, experience, and the fact that it's still the regular season, he might feel differently if it were the postseason.
I think he, he wants to continue as a starting pitcher.
That's, that's, pretty clear with their handling of this.
I do think that it would be, the team would be better served if they settle pretty quickly on what they wanna do with this, and pick five guys as opposed to having this jumble.
Because that, that, to me, can lead to more problems down the road if you don't make a choice.
I'll get you out of here on this, Buster.
Cal Raleigh back.
We saw him with the game-winning hit the other day.
Had a hit- Yeah on Wednesday as well.
For all the, the, the rubbish around them, there is one optimistic thing for the M's.
Yeah.
And I know from talking with the Mariners folks last week, I think they were glad that Cal had a chance to reset, you know, to go back.
Not that they were, anyone was glad that he was injured, but the injury allowed him to sort of build back up in a way that he wasn't able to in spring training this year, because of the WBC schedule, because they didn't have the, the typical training ground.
Well, now this was more, you know, the sort of preparation that he's used to as he's getting ready to play.
So it doesn't surprise me that he looks better right away.
And the other good thing, too, is, is that, you know, we all were wondering, "Okay, will he hit 60 homers this year?"
That's gone.
Yeah.
Like, he's not going to because of the injury.
He's not gonna approach his numbers.
So we can just focus on playing.
a- and he's gonna help.
And, and for, you know, for the Mariners, they get back one of the impactful catchers in baseball.
Buster, you're the best.
Much appreciated.
I'm off to Pittsburgh next week for Mariners and Pirates, so I'll report back to you from Pittsburgh, and, we'll talk then.
Have fun.
PNC's a great park.
All right.
That was Buster Olney, our ESPN MLB Insider, with us every single Thursday.
I am pumped to get off to Pittsburgh.
I am deathly curious as to what this lineup for the Mariners is gonna look like on Thursday.
So, uh- I don't know.
At this point, you just, you piece it together and you trust guys to get things done and you trust guys to, to do the little things.
The Mariners are gonna have to do the little things well if they wanna overcome what they're facing at this moment.
We will have a full episode coming up on Friday.
Appreciate Buster.
we'll talk to you in a little less than 24 hours as the Mariners wrap up this series with the Orioles and get ready to welcome the Boston Red Sox to town.
And former Red Sox infielder Lou Merloni is gonna stop by on tomorrow's show.
I love talking to Lou and I think you're gonna love listening to him as well.
We'll see you tomorrow, and go M's.
It's that time to put on your jersey and wave your flag, whoever you root for.
Why do I watch the World Cup?
That's like asking me why do I breathe .
And it's beautiful.
The guys are young and cute and fit.
It's not just a game.
It's your culture.
I like watching it with my dad.
It's a connecting force.
From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Echavarri, and this is American Ftbol, a show about soccer culture in the US and its underdog roots.
Listen to American Ftbol on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Joy is essential, and it's also elusive.
But now, there's a new and exciting way to start your journey toward a more joyful existence, Joy 101.
It's a new podcast hosted by me, Hoda Kotb.
If you're craving inspiration to maximize your joy, tune into these candid, uplifting, and moving on-air chats.
Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Joy 101, and listen now.
Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb is presented by CVS.
Happy Pride from the Outspoken Podcast Network.
All month long and all year round, we're celebrating being loud, proud, and always original.
It's me, Brandon Kyle Goodman, host of the podcast Tell Me Something Messy.
Check out my show for unfiltered takes on dating, relationships, and adulting.
Listen to High Key for the best pop culture takes, and There Are No Girls on the Internet for all your tech news.
For your favorite celebrity key keeps, check out Outlaws with Ts Madison.
Learn to love yourself unapologetically with BFF, Black Fat Femme, and start your day with intention with Waking Up With Ryan coming in July.
Celebrate Pride with the Outspoken network.
Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Pride, and listen now.
